User talk:Trappist the monk
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Chembox
Hey Trappist! It's been a while. :)
I'm currently dealing with infoboxes at my homewiki and updating some of them to similar standards as EnWiki's. During this journey I saw that infoboxes can vary wildly in technical aspects. I wasn't particularly happy about this because given the VAST use they have, each small change to them is usually accompanied with lots of changes on the articles they are used on, to reconfigure the parameters. And these kind of stuff is what usually make people grab their pitchforks and torches. Being that they don't have a well crystallized standard throughout all EnWiki, they're usually prone to dynamical changes which in small wikis are hard to replicate because of the numbers of users, tools and bots needed to clean after these changes. I asked around and was shown The Infobox Wars and The Wikidata Way. Taking the Wikidata route seems actually better at first sight but I worry about some details: not finding enough technical counseling, straying further from EnWiki, which is what we are mostly tied with as a community for templates/modules and for articles lately (because of Content Translation Tool - CTT already has problems dealing with infoboxes which was 50% of what made me start the whole update thing, the other 50% being lint errors) and having to change every infobox ever gradually to start implementing the wikidata way. Therefore I've settled to just continue updating them with EnWiki in mind and maybe in the future consider Wikidata again.
Having said all that, I stumbled upon {{Chembox}}. First of all, it's the first template I find that doesn't follow the naming "convention" of having "infobox" in its name. But as I said, I'm not surprised by these changes anymore. I'm just surprised by its large number of templates in its suite. Some being compromised of only 1-2 lines of codes. I think that kind of infrastructure is to make way for its modular function but halfway through importing them, I got tired and thought about asking before finishing them: I don't think it can be done anything to it, no? In my mind "a lot of templates" = "old design, needs to be redesigned in a simpler manner with Lua" but I'm not sure if that's the case here. I thought I'd ask so, if maybe my belief is correct, I wouldn't have to delete them all from the start. Your expertise would be valued. :) - Klein Muçi (talk) 10:00, 15 November 2021 (UTC)
Yikes. If you are suggesting that all of those 200-ish templates could/should be consolidated into a smaller suite of lua modules, you'll get no argument from me. I shall not be the one to do it – outside of my areas of interest.
Trappist the monk (talk) 16:23, 15 November 2021 (UTC)
Hmm, mostly I wanted to know if the consolidation was possible or no. Apparently it is possible. I was also hoping for you to lead me somewhere where to ask for help because I saw your latest contributions and I understood that you are still dealing with the taxonomic problem so you wouldn't be able to help much currently. (I'm grateful for that to be honest.) But I suppose I might give it a try at the talkpage of the template? And then, if nothing changes, I'll keep importing the remaining templates. - Klein Muçi (talk) 18:16, 15 November 2021 (UTC)
...Also... It's been a while I've wanted to get more involved with Lua, as you may remember. I'm 90% sure what I'll say next doesn't exist but if we already had somewhere something very similar with what needs to be done with the chembox template suite, I'd be happy to use that as an opportunity to learn and do the module consolidation work myself. But I believe if something similar enough for me to work on it existed, you'd have finished the work yourself, so... - Klein Muçi (talk) 19:10, 15 November 2021 (UTC)
I don't think that I know of any such place or thing though it would not surprise me to learn that such things exist – I did not know that
{{chembox}}
is as complicated as it is until you showed me.
Trappist the monk (talk) 19:59, 15 November 2021 (UTC)
I see. I'll try my luck on the talk page then.
Just so that I don't start a new discussion precisely about this: What are your thoughts on this discussion? I was thinking to ask at WT:LUA but maybe there's no need. - Klein Muçi (talk) 21:50, 15 November 2021 (UTC)
Sorry for the disturbance but maybe you have missed my last comment here? - Klein Muçi (talk) 08:44, 19 November 2021 (UTC)
That is a developer issue; some developer or team of developers would have to figure out how to implement one-line-only editing. I very much doubt that the developers would see one-line-only editing as something beneficial to the MediaWiki editing tool-set. What might be nice is some way to choose a line (for example this line), click 'something' that would open the page in the editor and take you to that line. It used to be that clicking the back-trace links in the Script error popup like:
Module:Citation/CS1/Date_validation/sandbox:61​: in function "is_valid_accessdate"
would open the editor and jump to the specified line; hasn't jumped to the specified line for quite a while. But, this scheme could only work for modules that are smaller than 100k bytes because the line numbering is part of the syntax highlighting which is disabled for modules larger than 100k bytes. Not going to hold my breath for that. Would be nice to have the back-trace links working again...
Trappist the monk (talk) 20:56, 20 November 2021 (UTC)
@Trappist the monk, oh yeah? I didn't know that used to be a functionality. That's what I'm suggesting as well there in that discussion (after I was told that editing single lines wouldn't be that much of a good idea): To be sent there to the line you wanted to edit or at least to have the specific line highlighted. The only change being that I was thinking of having an edit button be shown on the side of each line every time you hovered over a line and if you pressed that, it would work just like the back-trace link you talk about. Do you think it would be a good idea to ask for such a feature at Phabricator? And if so, how would you paraphrase it to be more easily understood by others? Your technical terminology is usually better than mine. - Klein Muçi (talk) 23:22, 20 November 2021 (UTC)
You could ask but I doubt that your request would be honored. As a first step, you might try hunting about in phabricator to see if the no-longer-working back-trace links have been reported and, if they have, what the resolution was. If reported and the result was something akin to 'won't-be-fixed-in-our-lifetime' then there is no point in asking about clicking a highlighted line at a module/js/css/json page to open the editor and jump to that line.
Trappist the monk (talk) 00:28, 21 November 2021 (UTC)
Okay then, if I find anything in regard to it, I'll report here. If not, maybe you can help me formulate a request for that. :) - Klein Muçi (talk) 08:39, 21 November 2021 (UTC)
Hello back! I wasn't able to find anything after searching for some terms. Can you help me formulate the text to make a request for what we talked? - Klein Muçi (talk) 19:09, 24 November 2021 (UTC)
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Question about wikidata
Hi Trappist, I just wanted to ask your advice on something. Is there a module which could read multiple values of instance of (P31) and look at their respective subclass of (P279) and tell me whether or not a particular entity is an instance of something? My particular use case is to know whether something is a lighthouse (Q39715) or not, and there are various subclasses it could be, e.g wooden lighthouse (Q66088335) or sparkplug lighthouse (Q7573695). Thanks — Martin (MSGJ · talk) 14:06, 27 November 2021 (UTC)
What I know about wikidata will fit in a thimble. Have you tried Module:WikidataIB and Module:Wd? Those are the only lua modules that I know of that deal with wikidata.
Trappist the monk (talk) 14:14, 27 November 2021 (UTC)
Okay will do. Sorry I thought it might be related to your work on taxonomy — Martin (MSGJ · talk) 15:51, 27 November 2021 (UTC)
Last edited on 27 November 2021, at 16:18
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