A Minneapolis police officer knelt on the neck of an African-American man named George Floyd for several minutes on Monday, as Floyd begged the officer to stop, said, “I can’t breathe,” and eventually lost consciousness. Floyd, who was forty-six, was pronounced dead at a hospital that evening. After video footage of Floyd’s asphyxiation, which was taken by bystanders, circulated online, the mayor of Minneapolis, Jacob Frey, announced on Tuesday that the four officers who had been at the scene had been fired. “This is the right call,” Frey said on Twitter. “Being Black in America should not be a death sentence.” The police had responded to a call that Floyd had used a forged check at a nearby deli and, in their first statement about the incident, noted only that he appeared to be “suffering medical distress.”
On Tuesday, the F.B.I. joined Minnesota’s criminal investigation of the incident, as Floyd’s family called for the four officers to be charged with murder. That afternoon, thousands of people gathered for protests in the streets of Minneapolis, which were followed that evening by clashes between riot police and protesters outside a precinct station. Protesters chanted “I can’t breathe,” which became a Black Lives Matter slogan after the death of Eric Garner, in New York, in 2014. The Minneapolis area has been the site of several contested police shootings and Black Lives Matter protests—most notably, after Philando Castile was pulled over and fatally shot by police in a suburb of Saint Paul, in 2016. The officer who killed Castile was fired from the police department but acquitted of manslaughter.
On Wednesday, I spoke by phone with Leslie Redmond, who, at twenty-eight, is an attorney and the president of the Minneapolis chapter of the N.A.A.C.P. During our conversation, which has been edited for length and clarity, we talked about racial inequities in Minneapolis, how activists are thinking about protests in the midst of a pandemic, and what steps she wants authorities to take regarding Floyd’s death.
What have the past couple days been like in the Minneapolis area?
It has been crazy. People on the ground are very upset and sad and disheartened, and rightfully so. I think about our young people, and how hard they are taking this. If people put it into perspective, for young people, they have grown up their entire lives watching black bodies murdered on social media, in real time, with no grief counsellors, with no therapy, with no one to help them make sense of it. And, to be honest, I don’t even know if we could make sense of it if we wanted to, because we are all just outraged and trying to figure it out.
What I have also seen, though, is black leaders coming together, and I am super thankful for Medaria Arradondo, who is the first African-American police chief we have ever had in Minneapolis. The way that he stepped up and brought us together during this time is just so honorable, and I know we wouldn’t be having the progress we are having if he wasn’t the police chief. And I think about five years ago—in the fall before Philando Castile, there was Jamar Clark, who was killed by police officers in Minneapolis. We had a completely different police chief, a woman named Janeé Harteau, and it was horrible. It was a completely different response. You didn’t see any action or accountability. [The Minneapolis Police Department conducted an internal investigation of Clark’s shooting and determined that the officers had not violated its use-of-force policy.] So for Chief Arradondo to do the right thing and fire all four of those officers, and for the mayor to support him, was a major step in the right direction. It doesn’t take away from the pain and hurt people are feeling on the ground, but it moves us in the right direction of getting some justice for Mr. Floyd.
What is your level of trust in the mayor on these issues?
I am thankful for Mayor Frey. I think he has been showing good leadership. But it is not just about what happens in this specific situation and this moment. It is about what follows it. Minnesota has some of the worst racial disparities in the nation. I tell people that even before COVID-19 we were in a state of emergency, and then that put us into a state of emergency times two. And now imagine having to deal with a black man being murdered by the government, by police officers, during this global pandemic. And so the burden has just been added to African-American communities, but the resources and the support have not been added. There has been no big lump sum that was poured into the community for us to pour into ourselves. And so that’s what I mean about it not just being about this moment—it’s about the moment that will follow, and the resources and communication that will follow this moment.
There were some demonstrations last night, but how do you think about organizing and marching and protests when there is a pandemic going on?
Protests are essential, and they have always been a part of the strategy. They are a tactic. But we are protesting to build power, and that is what people have to understand. A lot of people don’t really understand what goes on before and after. Black leadership was in communication with Chief Arradondo and in physical meetings with Chief Arradondo since 10 A.M. that morning. The protests didn’t start until 5 P.M. And so there was a lot of work being done before and after.
At the protests, for people who were on the ground originally, there was a really good effort and intent to push people back. And not only did most of the people in the crowd have masks on, but there were community organizations passing out masks, as they were already doing because of COVID-19. People asked why I didn’t have one on. Because of the tear gas, a lot of us had to remove our masks, but it wasn’t people blatantly trying to not social-distance and protect themselves.
Protesting feels generally like a much harder thing to do, with so many additional complications now.
It’s very complicated, and the reality of the situation is that we shouldn’t be in it. That is the biggest issue here. Had even one of these officers stepped up to say, “Hey, this man is in handcuffs already. He is down on the ground. He doesn’t need officers on his neck and back for over three minutes, with bystanders pleading, and telling you he is bleeding and that he can’t breathe.”
And, you know, Isaac, one of my biggest things is that this is not just a civil-rights issue—this is a human-rights issue, and the fact is that black people’s humanity is being denied constantly. And I worry about the humanity of individuals, and not just the police, because we know a lot of black people are dying at the hands of non-police officers. But specifically police officers—how can they turn off their humanity and kill black people in cold blood for what a lot of the time seems like nothing? It reminds you of much of the history of lynching in America. And now we are just being lynched without the ropes.
What are some of the racial disparities in Minneapolis and in Minnesota that concern you?
Different reports come out frequently, and almost every year Minnesota is on the list for having some of the worst disparities in the nation. That is the case with education—so, specifically, when we talk about truancy and blacks being disproportionately impacted by discipline. And when it comes to the housing market, and when it comes to jobs, and who is getting arrested and stopped.
A couple of years ago, the N.A.A.C.P. came up with the idea, and then began to collaborate with the A.C.L.U., to have warrant forgiveness days, because there were all these low-level warrants being given out. If anyone has ever had a warrant, it completely haunts people. And a lot of the time it was about poverty, because people didn’t have insurance and couldn’t afford to pay for something, not that they had actually committed a crime. Minnesota will rave about having some of the lowest prison rates, but they won’t talk about having some of the highest probation rates. We were able to work with the Minnesota Sentencing Guidelines Commission, and they ultimately moved to put a five-year cap on probation, because people were getting these extensive probation times.
So that is just an example of a lot of stuff going on in Minnesota. If you look on the surface, Minnesota is great. It has some of the best health care and education, and it is supposed to be “super-progressive.” But the question is who it is great for, and typically it is white people.
What about law enforcement in Minneapolis? You mentioned the police chief. Have things changed in other ways since his arrival?
We are very thankful for the chief. And we are seeing a lot of transformation, and I think it is holding people accountable. Because, like I said, his predecessor was not holding anyone accountable and did not help black people. He has been in the position since late 2017, but it’s about a system change, and I think he understands it’s about a system change. There is a police union that pushes against him, and there are a lot of people that do not like the changes that he is bringing. So he has been doing a tremendous job. But with everything it takes a team and community effort, and we need to see a paradigm shift and policy changes.
To have his coöperation makes a world of difference, because I was here five years ago, when Jamar Clark was killed, and I saw the community not get justice, and the disregard for the community. But it is about people who are interacting with the community on a daily basis. And Minnesota is very white. Very diverse communities are being over-policed by white bodies.
What do you want to see happen now in the Floyd case?
The demands moving forward were for all four officers to be fired, and that has already been accomplished. The next step is for Hennepin County to bring charges against the officers. I also know the F.B.I. is looking into it. And like I said, I don’t think it should be limited to civil rights. I think it should be looked at as a human-rights issue, and so there could potentially be both federal and state charges brought against these four individuals.
But we know we need systemic reform and change. So what does that look like? Resources need to be poured into the African-American community, and not so limited and with so many loops and holes. The system often does it wrong, and the black community really needs to be a decision-maker at the table and be given proper resources. And we need reform of how police officers function. And I think training is going to be a huge component, and that training needs to come from the community. And we have amazing educators from the black community. Before people are put out here in our communities, they need to be working with us, and we need to be able to train them.
Can you talk about the effect that the coronavirus has had on the black community in Minneapolis?
It’s been horrible. Black people were already in a state of emergency, and now we are constantly being denied access to health care. This is not new. Martin Luther King, Jr., warned us that, of all the forms of inequity, injustice in the health-care system is the most inhumane and shocking. One of the reasons that we continue to have the disparities is that we continue to perpetuate the status quo, and we are unwilling to be bold and courageous.
When you look at the press conferences, and you look at who is making the decisions about the coronavirus, it is primarily white men and some white women who are tasked with the questions of how to fix things that are disproportionately impacting our community. We are not the decision-makers, and that structure just further perpetuates the injustices. We are definitely disproportionately impacted, and we have so many other crises to deal with. We were not similarly situated from the beginning. That is why, while some people were stocking up on tissues and Lysol, other people were trying to figure out how they could eat and pay their rent and survive.
Race, Policing, and Black Lives Matter Protests
- The death of George Floyd, in context.
- The civil-rights lawyer Bryan Stevenson examines the frustration and despair behind the protests.
- Who, David Remnick asks, is the true agitator behind the racial unrest?
- A sociologist examines the so-called pillars of whiteness that prevent white Americans from confronting racism.
- The Black Lives Matter co-founder Opal Tometi on what it would mean to defund police departments, and what comes next.
- The quest to transform the United States cannot be limited to challenging its brutal police.
